le post de fyds sur kraft et moore.

je cherche depuis qq jours des points de vue de forumeurs éclairés sur kraft et moore,qui sont des prétendants à rentrer dans le capital de lfc voici l'avis de fyds.c'est fyds qui a fait le fond d'écran que vous avez trouvé sur ce forum.
je vais traduire les principaux arguments plus bas.

Quote :

I'm based in the Wye Valley but am doing lots of work on 2008 City of culture projects. Kraft has been looking to expand his interest in sport. He has a particular interest in community based, family run clubs rather than the conglomerate share-holder approach - this follows the pattern of his business practice thus far, and the way he has invested in his New England teams. In many ways by reading up on him - there's plenty on the web - the impresion strongly created is that of a rich paternalistic Democrat of the old school - add to this that Stevie Nicol who succesfully manages the New England Fire has sold him and his people on Liverpool, the romance of the club and our recent achievements and we could be tailor made for each other.

As to whether he would be looking for a conventional return on his investment, he hasn't so far on the Patriots which like us, largely now pay for themelves as they are exceptionally well run - he still chucks the odd wad at them from time to time as needed. At the same time, it might be worth someone in the US (Scot? - your'e good at this stuff!) investigating the tax or other financial breaks he may possibly accrue at home by shipping funds over here to take on Liverpool.

For DH:
Of course David Moores does not want to be ripped off on his shares - who would? Not me! To say therefore he's only in it for what he can get - his own personal interest ignores several things:

1) Like it or not, he is a devoted Liverpool fan - even ES will back that up. According to ES, he personally intervened to stop Gerrard going to the Chavs - thus depriving himself as chair and controlling shareholder of a large slice for his back-pocket should he have been so inclined - he wasn't.
2) He could simply sell 'overnight' to the Thai's, Morgan (rip-off man), Kraft - anyone - and walk away with the cash like Bates did at Chelsea.
3) It was his idea (with Parry) to seek new investment to take the club forward in the full knowledge that their own positions would undeniably come up for question and posible release
4) He could instruct the board to go the PLC route and make an even bigger killing even quicker.
5) He could sell out at face value to a holding company, institution or the club's bank and get the full face value of his shares and a negotiated 'controlling interest' bonus to boot.

Only number one and number three are indicative and are the current state. he does not want to be ripped off, but says he also wants what's best for the club Given what actions he could take, I see no objective reason to disbelieve him.

réponse de david hodgson(un forumeur):

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My problem with our chairman is more to do with my firm belief that he values his techncial overall control of LFC on a personal emotional level. It's unkind to call it his favourite 'toy' but it is clearly an entity he can't give up. I think his emotional attachment to the idea of 'owning' LFC could prejudice his judgement in relation to what is actually best for the club.

Beyond that, I just don't think he's a very bright guy, and I sense he lacks real leadership skills.

réponse de fyds:

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Re the top point. I agree that would ordinarily be a genuine and valid concern - anyone who has attended an AGM would I feel give testament to Moores' 'personal and emotional' devotion to the club - obversely, I don't think this is a bad thing, as he knows he's getting older and only has a few years left to properly devote his energies and time. This i part of the reason for the investment search - someone, if the right one can be found - to take it on. One person I know well is convinced if Morgan had not been on the prowl he may have actually gone two years ago and handed control over to the board and retaining his shares until an appropriate buyer could be found - I don't know if this is true, but it wouldn't completely surprise me.

He will sell - of that I'm sure - providing all the cultural, financial and definitively Liverpudlian terms we all argue about (and a few we don't even know about) are adequately met - I'm equally certain that although it isn't over until it's over - this is already very much on track, with all the noises indicating Bob Kraft and his people being in poll position - I for one hope so.

Re your last point - apart from one tiny moment - I've never spoken with the man. However, in the line of work I'm currently in I meet a few people who have spoken with him, done busines with him and may even count him as a friend - one on the JMU management exec in particular. They would disagree, one phrase I can remember from Peter Marshall, an acquaintance of his and long time friend of the late Billy Liddel described him as 'witty and incisive' - not the normal description of a dullard. His predecessor, the great John Smith also thought him the owner of a 'fine and responsible mind'. At AGM's he is considered and polite, occasionally witty but not the dictator variety of chairman. Admittedly, most of this is second hand but tellingly it's all pretty positive.

Currently, we are in good and improving shape - let's see where we are a couple of years down the line.

Thanks Autumn, this is a very interesting and thought provoking insight to what is happening behind the scenes in connection with who is going to provide the money to take the club to the next stage of development i.e. the new stadium and how.

David Kraft seems to be the ideal candidate, interestingly do you think Stevie Nicol would want to return as Manager?

en etant honnête avec toi,george,je ne savais pas que stevie nicol avait des vues pour être manager à lfc.

je ne veux pas que rafa parte!!!!
j'adore rafa !!!!!
rafa est le nouveau shankly,il construit brique par brique le renouveau de liverpool.

j'ai trouvé ces posts très interessants,je les ai lu très vite.fyds est un ami.
je peux peut être lui demander des informations complémentaires,remarque,pour qu'on en sache un peu plus.

j'ai oublié de préciser que ES signifie elisha scott qui est un forumeur assez négatif de ynwa,dans le sens où il a des avis très tranchés.il est très conservateurs dans ces opinions.
david moores commence à se faire vieux.je ne tiens pas à dire qu'il est grabataire mais prévoir la stratégie du club à long terme nous oblige à réfléchir là dessus.effectivement,kraft me parait être la moins mauvaise des solutions.

It would be great if we could have more info on what is happening. I don't think it is a case of Moores getting old. It has more to do with the fact that he is not that rich. His family however are very rich indeed but all the money is tied up in a family trust preventing him from investing it in Liverpool. That is why he is looking for a new investor as he alone does not have the financial muscle to see through projects such as the new stadium. We have to find a backer for this to become reality. There is no doubt he would like to also recover the not insignificant funds he has invested in the club and why not.

steve nicol reussit bien aux etats unis,c'etait un grand joueur et il pourrait nous etre utile i think!!